-----------------
poster: Lu
subject: sorcs
date: Mon Apr 22 21:14:36 2002
i just finished maxxing the sorc omicron blasting spell, it just
happens to be useless
currently, with 817 int, itt costs 144 sps to do unattuned damage,
and is still 4 rnds like my bravo spells
my worst bravo spell is breath of magic, which costs 108 sps, and
has a special
just wodnering if something is wrong with the prismatic spray code,
or if the spell is meant to be totally useless
-lu
-----------------
poster: Fox
subject: Lava Mage
date: Tue May 7 07:25:46 2002
It needs a spell to revert form.
-----------------
poster: Bloodlust
subject: hp change
date: Tue May 21 08:41:54 2002
i have noticed when i go from flesh to mist when im not at full
health that my hps drop alot more than when im going from mist to
flesh whether im at full hps when i go flesh or partial. this is
something that i have just noticed, because this is not the
-----------------
poster: Bloodlust
subject: hp change....
date: Tue May 21 08:43:18 2002
same as when i was lava mage.
:is healed as Benny Henn raises his hands to the heavens above.
-----------------
poster: Tranquil
subject: Hp change revisited
date: Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002
I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
'The other lava mage'.
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002
On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> 'The other lava mage'.
>
*sigh*
The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
-WC
-----------------
poster: Chewba
subject: >>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002
On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > 'The other lava mage'.
> >
>
> *sigh*
>
> The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
>
> -WC
...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 03:29:01 2002
On Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002 Chewba wrote post #7:
> On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> > On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > > 'The other lava mage'.
> > >
> >
> > *sigh*
> >
> > The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> > you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
> >
> > -WC
> ...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
list, ya smegging wanker.
If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
unsub from the fucking groups.
-WC
-----------------
poster: Sleet
subject: >>>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 03:30:01 2002
On Wed May 22 03:29:01 2002 Wildchild wrote post #8:
> On Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002 Chewba wrote post #7:
> > On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> > > On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > > > 'The other lava mage'.
> > > >
> > >
> > > *sigh*
> > >
> > > The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> > > you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
> > >
> > > -WC
> > ...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
>
> I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
> list, ya smegging wanker.
>
> If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
> unsub from the fucking groups.
>
> -WC
god i hate that command, it never solves anything, people still are
idiots and you still know what there talkign about, you just hear
from them indirectly
-----------------
poster: Chewba
subject: >>>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 09:52:09 2002
On Wed May 22 03:29:01 2002 Wildchild wrote post #8:
> On Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002 Chewba wrote post #7:
> > On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> > > On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > > > 'The other lava mage'.
> > > >
> > >
> > > *sigh*
> > >
> > > The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> > > you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
> > >
> > > -WC
> > ...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
>
> I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
> list, ya smegging wanker.
>
> If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
> unsub from the fucking groups.
>
> -WC
That actually was not pointed at you WC. but heh you won't get this
as I am ignored. :)
-----------------
poster: Kaos
subject: >>>>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 09:59:43 2002
> > I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
> > list, ya smegging wanker.
> >
> > If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
> > unsub from the fucking groups.
> >
> > -WC
> god i hate that command, it never solves anything, people still are
> idiots and you still know what there talkign about, you just hear
> from them indirectly
Actually, no, if it wasn't for the ignore command I probably
wouldn't bother logging in here. But right now, it's all peachy.
-----------------
poster: Chewba
subject: >>>>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 10:05:04 2002
On Wed May 22 03:30:01 2002 Sleet wrote post #9:
> On Wed May 22 03:29:01 2002 Wildchild wrote post #8:
> > On Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002 Chewba wrote post #7:
> > > On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> > > > On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > > > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > > > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > > > > 'The other lava mage'.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > *sigh*
> > > >
> > > > The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> > > > you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
> > > >
> > > > -WC
> > > ...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
> >
> > I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
> > list, ya smegging wanker.
> >
> > If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
> > unsub from the fucking groups.
> >
> > -WC
> god i hate that command, it never solves anything, people still are
> idiots and you still know what there talkign about, you just hear
> from them indirectly
Nods sleet perhaps my first point was a little clouded I was refer
as bitching as the sarcastic point of
> > > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist >
> > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called > >
> > 'The other lava mage'. > > > >
Now if tranquil wants to call me a smegging wanker and ignore me
that is fine but the fact that a lot of news posts to me seem to
read as
1) A not fully backed up idea / observation get puts into news.
2) A few people flame it. In my opinion a lot of these posts seem to
high the original poster in disgust for heving the gall to write
these posts.
3) People do 2) to people that wrote 2) 's.
This is pointless and I spose by writing this I, suppose I am, by
responding this adding to this cultutre. I'm not going to post in
news for a while cannot by bothered but I won't subscribe as there
are some usefull posts here.
-----------------
poster: Dalak
subject: >>>>Hp change revisited
date: Wed May 22 12:52:24 2002
On Wed May 22 03:29:01 2002 Wildchild wrote post #8:
> On Wed May 22 03:02:42 2002 Chewba wrote post #7:
> > On Wed May 22 01:04:47 2002 Wildchild wrote post #6:
> > > On Tue May 21 13:48:02 2002 Tranquil wrote post #5:
> > > > I would like to bring one thing to your attention, bloodlust. Mist
> > > > mage is _not_ like lava mage. If it was, the guild would be called
> > > > 'The other lava mage'.
> > > >
> > >
> > > *sigh*
> > >
> > > The general effects are, I'm sure, what he was referring to: that
> > > you gain/lose con, which in turn you gain/lose hps.
> > >
> > > -WC
> > ...........................CAN EVERY ONE STOP BITCHING?
>
> I'm not bitching. Instead of bitching, I'm putting you on my ignore
> list, ya smegging wanker.
>
> If you can't handle people actually trying to explain something,
> unsub from the fucking groups.
>
> -WC
WC is my hero for obvious reasons :)
Dal-Hoor
-----------------
poster: Kjara
subject: Hp change stuffs
date: Wed May 22 21:04:50 2002
I think i know what he was talking about, every other guild when you
put up the body your max hp incresases
In mist it goes down, now this wouldn't be a problem but the way
bodies work is, say you have 80/100 hp before the body
after putting up bol you would have 160/200 and after putting up
mist form you would have 40/50, when a body falls
you don't lose or gain hps so if bol falls and you have 160/200 hp
you will end up with 100/100 hps because you can't have more then
your max
while when mist falls you will have 40/100 hps because you don't
gain any either, I noticed this when i was
cast green mist at a and while it isn't a problem, it is sorta odd.
Kjara
p.s. the number are just a example, just notice the ratios between
them and don't worry about exact hps
-----------------
poster: Kjara
subject: quick update to the last one
date: Wed May 22 21:07:44 2002
the "cast green mist at a" was suposted be just a mist, forgot about
zmud aliases :)
-----------------
poster: Arkangyle
subject: >Hp change stuffs
date: Thu May 23 04:14:39 2002
On Wed May 22 21:04:50 2002 Kjara wrote post #14:
> I think i know what he was talking about, every other guild when you
> put up the body your max hp incresases
> In mist it goes down, now this wouldn't be a problem but the way
> bodies work is, say you have 80/100 hp before the body
> after putting up bol you would have 160/200 and after putting up
> mist form you would have 40/50, when a body falls
> you don't lose or gain hps so if bol falls and you have 160/200 hp
> you will end up with 100/100 hps because you can't have more then
> your max
> while when mist falls you will have 40/100 hps because you don't
> gain any either, I noticed this when i was
> cast green mist at a and while it isn't a problem, it is sorta odd.
> Kjara
> p.s. the number are just a example, just notice the ratios between
> them and don't worry about exact hps
From "my" experience working as a mist mage (and yes I consider 16
months in the guild significant) the affect of hp loss following
mist form disolving is rather insignificant. As a mist mage, you
require very little healing or time "regening" in order to be fully
healed.
However, I have, and am still, a fan of the concept of ratio
adjustments. By this I mean, if you have 50% of your hps and you
put up BOL, you should have 50% of your new Max hps ... if you are
at 50% when body falls, it should reduce or increase your hps so
that they stay in the same ratio. But that's just my opinion.
-----------------
poster: Sigwald
subject: Hp change & stuff
date: Thu May 23 13:26:41 2002
Hmm I'll look into that, it was supposed to work like Arkangyle
described it basically... Though I'll admit it may not, since
keeping up this percent thing tends to be rather shitty...
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >>Hp change stuffs
date: Fri May 24 01:36:24 2002
On Thu May 23 04:14:39 2002 Arkangyle wrote post #16:
> On Wed May 22 21:04:50 2002 Kjara wrote post #14:
> > I think i know what he was talking about, every other guild when you
> > put up the body your max hp incresases
> > In mist it goes down, now this wouldn't be a problem but the way
> > bodies work is, say you have 80/100 hp before the body
> > after putting up bol you would have 160/200 and after putting up
> > mist form you would have 40/50, when a body falls
> > you don't lose or gain hps so if bol falls and you have 160/200 hp
> > you will end up with 100/100 hps because you can't have more then
> > your max
> > while when mist falls you will have 40/100 hps because you don't
> > gain any either, I noticed this when i was
> > cast green mist at a and while it isn't a problem, it is sorta odd.
> > Kjara
> > p.s. the number are just a example, just notice the ratios between
> > them and don't worry about exact hps
>
> From "my" experience working as a mist mage (and yes I consider 16
> months in the guild significant) the affect of hp loss following
> mist form disolving is rather insignificant. As a mist mage, you
> require very little healing or time "regening" in order to be fully
> healed.
>
> However, I have, and am still, a fan of the concept of ratio
> adjustments. By this I mean, if you have 50% of your hps and you
> put up BOL, you should have 50% of your new Max hps ... if you are
> at 50% when body falls, it should reduce or increase your hps so
> that they stay in the same ratio. But that's just my opinion.
Here's how it looks for me:
1099/1099 for hps before mist form
I cast mist form
777/777 hps afterward
If I then cast solidify (or mist form drops) I'm at 777/1099 hps.
So yes, I like what Ark said regarding ratios, and hopefully it is
something Siggy can fix :)
-WC
-----------------
poster: Sigwald
subject: >Hp change & stuff
date: Mon May 27 10:13:45 2002
On Thu May 23 13:26:41 2002 Sigwald wrote post #17:
> Hmm I'll look into that, it was supposed to work like Arkangyle
> described it basically... Though I'll admit it may not, since
> keeping up this percent thing tends to be rather shitty...
Well I've tried to hack around this. You will get back to that
percent you had before it falls, but it will takes 3 seconds
to kick in. There is not really an easy way around this...
Report if it causes problems.
-----------------
poster: Sleet
subject: >>Hp change & stuff
date: Mon May 27 10:15:09 2002
why 3 seconds?
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >>>Hp change & stuff
date: Wed May 29 02:58:55 2002
On Mon May 27 10:15:09 2002 Sleet wrote post #20:
> why 3 seconds?
Most likely that it takes that long for the next heartbeat to update
the hps to the proper amount.
-WC
-----------------
poster: Fox
subject: Mist Mage
date: Thu Jun 6 09:06:07 2002
Maybe it's just me, but, how I see this is a royall pain in the arse.
I've seen my sp_regen go from a 379 tock @ lvl 50 to 419 @ lvl 82
while in mist form, this is including a greater regen wish. Sure,
it's possible to sit and regen for ever. But, this is a problem. I
solo maybe 10 minutes and I tap, I have to regen for 5-9 minutes,
depending on my tick/tock ratio. There needs to be an increased
sp_regen w/in the guilds. Hence, while in Mist Form you have a guild
ring, which is all mist can hold. There needs to be some sort of way
to either have a higher sp_regen given along w/ the guild leveling
in Mist Mage and/or be able to wield the weapons that the Mist Mage
can create, ie: Ice Pick, Air Shield...and whatever else...
Feel Free to flame/destroy/maim/praise this to whatever extent.
-----------------
poster: Midnight
subject: re post 22: Mist Mages
date: Thu Jun 6 15:13:38 2002
as i experience it, Mist Mages aren't the only ones with long regen
time. Evoker seems to have the long regen time because they have to
charge their amulets with sp's as well as use sp themselves. It is
true that the waiting time can be irksome but there should be a
possibility for boosting the regen like the regeneration trance
within all mage schools then not just evoker.
hope that doesn't sound as confused as i think it does.
Midnight
-----------------
poster: Phire
subject: >re post 22: Mist Mages
date: Thu Jun 6 15:25:23 2002
On Thu Jun 6 15:13:38 2002 Midnight wrote post #23:
> as i experience it, Mist Mages aren't the only ones with long regen
> time. Evoker seems to have the long regen time because they have to
> charge their amulets with sp's as well as use sp themselves. It is
> true that the waiting time can be irksome but there should be a
> possibility for boosting the regen like the regeneration trance
> within all mage schools then not just evoker.
> hope that doesn't sound as confused as i think it does.
> Midnight
This is one of the great trade offs for mist mage. The in-ability to wear eq
(thus lowering spr regen) with an awesome defense (for a blaster).
If you notice, you do get a bonus to spreg when in mist form. Also,
as a mist mage, you should definitely be taking advantage of stat training for
spreg.
At least be glad that you don't have to time the ticks to leave the
room to make
sure you don't miss any.
Phire
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >re post 22: Mist Mages
date: Thu Jun 6 18:50:46 2002
I was just evoker up to lvl 44 and never had a prob with regen,
between mindflayer and regen trance i was always fine, when i needed
to regen, which didnt happen much even with qc and HEF at 85%, I am
now, coincidentaly a mist mage, now I do tap as mist, but its fine
cause in mist form i tock rather well. I assume things like regen
trance andf bodies were made in part to help this, and I personally
dont have a prob
Get new eq?
-----------------
poster: Tektor
subject: Mist Mages
date: Fri Jun 7 02:10:42 2002
I think most people miss the point of the orignal post. #1 A
suggestion as get new eq isn't very helpful when mistform can't use
eq. #2 He was pointing out that with a gain of 30 lvls (I'm assuming
he got 30 glvls as well) he only got a very small bost to spr in
mistform. Sure mistform is spiffy def prot but for those who can't
get to nether it keeps you stuck for awhile.
Unless of course you reinc something else but whats the fun in that?
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >Mist Mages
date: Fri Jun 7 02:19:49 2002
On Fri Jun 7 02:10:42 2002 Tektor wrote post #26:
> I think most people miss the point of the orignal post. #1 A
> suggestion as get new eq isn't very helpful when mistform can't use
> eq. #2 He was pointing out that with a gain of 30 lvls (I'm assuming
> he got 30 glvls as well) he only got a very small bost to spr in
> mistform. Sure mistform is spiffy def prot but for those who can't
> get to nether it keeps you stuck for awhile.
> Unless of course you reinc something else but whats the fun in that?
You get "stuck" as mist mage because the guild was laid out quite
poorly (with mist filling out levels to get to more power, ie,
nether, altho mist is alot better than lava anyways).
I have some problems tapping, but it's not as bad since I have
traveller stuff. Having the elemental ring is only going to improve
things for me for sure.
I got 8 levels in stat trainers for spr, but I'm not sure how much
it's really helping.
But it never made sense to me that eq you can make in a previous
elemental guild (ie, the air shield and ice pick) cannot be used
while in mist form.
Otherwise, we might as well not be able to have our elemental rings
in mist form either.
-WC
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >Mist Mages
date: Fri Jun 7 06:06:44 2002
i meant cast solidify and wear your eq when tapped just to calrify
but yeah I can see what your saying about the boots, just commenting
that i didnt notice taht the boost was small, i tick only 30spr less
in mist form, of course that could just mean i have shit for eq,
IMHO 400 is a good tock for my lvl, am I wrong? I havent been at
this high of a level before
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >>Mist Mages
date: Fri Jun 7 06:07:55 2002
You cant have your ring in mistform, it leaves and then comes back
to you when you solidify, uinless it was changed since i got the
message:
You feel that some items awere magicly returnmed to you
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: oops!
date: Fri Jun 7 06:37:51 2002
my bad
I was wrong
the message is
You feel some special magical items were returned to you!
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: I suck
date: Fri Jun 7 06:42:09 2002
okok so I see that i am wearing it in mist form, so then i change my
unfoudned assholeness to a question.
What exactly is being returned to me when i solidify?
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >I suck
date: Sat Jun 8 01:38:05 2002
On Fri Jun 7 06:42:09 2002 Korthrun wrote post #31:
> okok so I see that i am wearing it in mist form, so then i change my
> unfoudned assholeness to a question.
> What exactly is being returned to me when i solidify?
Hell if I know, I never saw the message :)
-WC
-----------------
poster: Arkangyle
subject: >>I suck
date: Sat Jun 8 03:58:19 2002
On Sat Jun 8 01:38:05 2002 Wildchild wrote post #32:
> On Fri Jun 7 06:42:09 2002 Korthrun wrote post #31:
> > okok so I see that i am wearing it in mist form, so then i change my
> > unfoudned assholeness to a question.
> > What exactly is being returned to me when i solidify?
>
> Hell if I know, I never saw the message :)
>
> -WC
If you have summoned items (air shield/ice pick/flame blade/earth
staff) and you mist, when the enchantment falls these items are
returned to your posession and it delivers that message. I don't
believe I remember seeing it a case where the only item I had was
the elemental ring though.
- Ark
-----------------
poster: Sleet
subject: >re post 22: Mist Mages
date: Sat Jun 8 09:53:55 2002
On Thu Jun 6 15:13:38 2002 Midnight wrote post #23:
> as i experience it, Mist Mages aren't the only ones with long regen
> time. Evoker seems to have the long regen time because they have to
> charge their amulets with sp's as well as use sp themselves. It is
> true that the waiting time can be irksome but there should be a
> possibility for boosting the regen like the regeneration trance
> within all mage schools then not just evoker.
> hope that doesn't sound as confused as i think it does.
> Midnight
my expierances with mist mages are that they dont regan that slow
compared to gulds ive tried before, maybe sspr wise t hey could but
hp they regan even faster since there doing a greater percentage of
hp everyheal for the same hp
-----------------
poster: Zyz
subject: evokers
date: Mon Jun 10 18:13:30 2002
Tried evoker in a 1.4g gargoyle body. Maxed (100/100) 8 bravo 4
round spells and affecting skills.
That is less than 1/3 of bravo and omicron spells. If I wanted to
train area spells and 2 rounders,
it would cost another gig or so. Guess my point is that the bravo
spells are very expensive,
which basically means evokers generally aren't well rounded. If a
goal is to have
players train 4 rounders, 2 rounders, and area spells, and choose
the best spell for
the situation, the spell cost should probably be lowered a bit.
Right now, even 100%
training of the 24 bravo spells and associated skills is only
possible for a multigig
player. Maybe this was the intent. Just seemed kinda silly to me
that 1.4g in a cheap
race would train only 1/3 of bravo spells. -Zyz
-----------------
poster: Uno
subject: >evokers
date: Mon Jun 10 21:36:43 2002
On Mon Jun 10 18:13:30 2002 Zyz wrote post #35:
> Tried evoker in a 1.4g gargoyle body. Maxed (100/100) 8 bravo 4
> round spells and affecting skills.
> That is less than 1/3 of bravo and omicron spells. If I wanted to
> train area spells and 2 rounders,
> it would cost another gig or so. Guess my point is that the bravo
> spells are very expensive,
> which basically means evokers generally aren't well rounded. If a
> goal is to have
> players train 4 rounders, 2 rounders, and area spells, and choose
> the best spell for
> the situation, the spell cost should probably be lowered a bit.
> Right now, even 100%
> training of the 24 bravo spells and associated skills is only
> possible for a multigig
> player. Maybe this was the intent. Just seemed kinda silly to me
> that 1.4g in a cheap
> race would train only 1/3 of bravo spells. -Zyz
isn't it true though that that 1.4 g would enable you to be
a serious force for both soloing and partying for xp?
i think that that fully rounded nature IS intended to be reserved
for higher level players. i think admins have acknowledged they
expect a player to 'max' out any given guild at around 2.5-3g
this doesn't seem all that out of whack with the gameplan.
of course having never been caster, my opinion may mean nil.
i'm just interpreting your post as i understand it.
-----------------
poster: Sleet
subject: >>evokers
date: Mon Jun 10 23:18:26 2002
On Mon Jun 10 21:36:43 2002 Uno wrote post #36:
> On Mon Jun 10 18:13:30 2002 Zyz wrote post #35:
> > Tried evoker in a 1.4g gargoyle body. Maxed (100/100) 8 bravo 4
> > round spells and affecting skills.
> > That is less than 1/3 of bravo and omicron spells. If I wanted to
> > train area spells and 2 rounders,
> > it would cost another gig or so. Guess my point is that the bravo
> > spells are very expensive,
> > which basically means evokers generally aren't well rounded. If a
> > goal is to have
> > players train 4 rounders, 2 rounders, and area spells, and choose
> > the best spell for
> > the situation, the spell cost should probably be lowered a bit.
> > Right now, even 100%
> > training of the 24 bravo spells and associated skills is only
> > possible for a multigig
> > player. Maybe this was the intent. Just seemed kinda silly to me
> > that 1.4g in a cheap
> > race would train only 1/3 of bravo spells. -Zyz
> isn't it true though that that 1.4 g would enable you to be
> a serious force for both soloing and partying for xp?
> i think that that fully rounded nature IS intended to be reserved
> for higher level players. i think admins have acknowledged they
> expect a player to 'max' out any given guild at around 2.5-3g
> this doesn't seem all that out of whack with the gameplan.
> of course having never been caster, my opinion may mean nil.
> i'm just interpreting your post as i understand it.
i like that, i think we should make the rest of the guilds max out
around, increases the playability of the guild assuming its playable
at lower levels, my guild is maxed out right now at 100/100 and im
not even worth 500 megs...
that seems kinda small
-----------------
poster: Zifnab
subject: >>>evokers
date: Tue Jun 11 03:54:09 2002
> i like that, i think we should make the rest of the guilds max out
> around, increases the playability of the guild assuming its playable
> at lower levels, my guild is maxed out right now at 100/100 and im
> not even worth 500 megs...
> that seems kinda small
You have been told many times that you are in a guild that is
incomplete, and will remain so until ideas come around as to
a way to rewrite it.
**
-----------------
poster: Zyz
subject: >>evokers
date: Sat Aug 3 01:47:25 2002
On Mon Jun 10 21:36:43 2002 Uno wrote post #36:
> > that 1.4g in a cheap
> > race would train only 1/3 of bravo spells. -Zyz
> isn't it true though that that 1.4 g would enable you to be
> a serious force for both soloing and partying for xp?
> i think that that fully rounded nature IS intended to be reserved
> for higher level players. i think admins have acknowledged they
> expect a player to 'max' out any given guild at around 2.5-3g
> this doesn't seem all that out of whack with the gameplan.
> of course having never been caster, my opinion may mean nil.
> i'm just interpreting your post as i understand it.
For comparison, 1.4g will train 100/100 all useful skills/spells in
nether mage and witch.
Abjurer has a ton of spells, but 1.4g will come close to maxxing all
of those. Druid can
max nearly all useful spells/skills at 1.4g. Harmers can max all,
and healers are just
short of maxxing everything useful at that worth (without getting a
4th bravo).
Note: this is using gargoyle race for all examples.
Solo functionality for evoker comes with a secondary healing guild, not with
training the evoker spells. In other guilds with many spells to
train, the spells
are reduced in price (see witch/abjurer). I just thought it was strange that
evoker spells cost so much. At the current prices, very few evokers,
regardless of
worth, are fully trained. -Zyz
-----------------
poster: Balinor
subject: Familiar
date: Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002
Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
-----------------
poster: Apathy
subject: >Familiar
date: Tue Sep 3 17:27:40 2002
On Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002 Balinor wrote post #40:
> Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
> elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
Isn't this basically what floating disc does?
-Apathy
-----------------
poster: Uno
subject: >>Familiar
date: Tue Sep 3 17:30:10 2002
On Tue Sep 3 17:27:40 2002 Apathy wrote post #41:
> On Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002 Balinor wrote post #40:
> > Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
> > elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
>
> Isn't this basically what floating disc does?
>
> -Apathy
i support the familiar idea for other purposes though...
perhaps make him a weak but rather magical companion that DOES fight
with the mage. Not sure what this would do to balance but I
like the role-playing aspect of it.
-----------------
poster: Litho
subject: >>>Familiar
date: Tue Sep 3 19:35:42 2002
On Tue Sep 3 17:30:10 2002 Uno wrote post #42:
> On Tue Sep 3 17:27:40 2002 Apathy wrote post #41:
> > On Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002 Balinor wrote post #40:
> > > Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
> > > elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
> >
> > Isn't this basically what floating disc does?
> >
> > -Apathy
> i support the familiar idea for other purposes though...
> perhaps make him a weak but rather magical companion that DOES fight
> with the mage. Not sure what this would do to balance but I
> like the role-playing aspect of it.
Anyone remember the spell summmon lesser monster in evoker tree?
i think trhe mage guild should be left as is with the disc
-----------------
poster: Trigon
subject: >>>>Familiar
date: Wed Sep 4 06:13:32 2002
On Tue Sep 3 19:35:42 2002 Litho wrote post #43:
> On Tue Sep 3 17:30:10 2002 Uno wrote post #42:
> > On Tue Sep 3 17:27:40 2002 Apathy wrote post #41:
> > > On Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002 Balinor wrote post #40:
> > > > Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
> > > > elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
> > >
> > > Isn't this basically what floating disc does?
> > >
> > > -Apathy
> > i support the familiar idea for other purposes though...
> > perhaps make him a weak but rather magical companion that DOES fight
> > with the mage. Not sure what this would do to balance but I
> > like the role-playing aspect of it.
> Anyone remember the spell summmon lesser monster in evoker tree?
> i think trhe mage guild should be left as is with the disc
Summon Lesser monster was my goal when I was a smaller player. I
have always wanted to have a little guy follow me.
I squealed when animal tamer was put in
SQUEALED!!
And I've wanted summon lesser monster back every since :(
Familiars rock, even if they suck they just add a fun element to the
game, and I really think every guild should have them :)
Trigon
-----------------
poster: Balinor
subject: >>>>>Familiar
date: Wed Sep 4 12:36:10 2002
On Wed Sep 4 06:13:32 2002 Trigon wrote post #44:
> On Tue Sep 3 19:35:42 2002 Litho wrote post #43:
> > On Tue Sep 3 17:30:10 2002 Uno wrote post #42:
> > > On Tue Sep 3 17:27:40 2002 Apathy wrote post #41:
> > > > On Tue Sep 3 14:46:02 2002 Balinor wrote post #40:
> > > > > Hello, i think mages could use a familiar spell that would summon an
> > > > > elemental to carry some stuff, and not to be in fight
> > > >
> > > > Isn't this basically what floating disc does?
> > > >
> > > > -Apathy
> > > i support the familiar idea for other purposes though...
> > > perhaps make him a weak but rather magical companion that DOES fight
> > > with the mage. Not sure what this would do to balance but I
> > > like the role-playing aspect of it.
> > Anyone remember the spell summmon lesser monster in evoker tree?
> > i think trhe mage guild should be left as is with the disc
> Summon Lesser monster was my goal when I was a smaller player. I
> have always wanted to have a little guy follow me.
> I squealed when animal tamer was put in
> SQUEALED!!
> And I've wanted summon lesser monster back every since :(
> Familiars rock, even if they suck they just add a fun element to the
> game, and I really think every guild should have them :)
> Trigon
The familiar could be the type that can loot stuff and hunt food too.
-----------------
poster: Daneel
subject: synergy
date: Sun Sep 22 06:47:57 2002
I lowered the upper limit of how magical items can be for use
with this spell.
-----------------
poster: Goroharahad
subject: ring of elements
date: Sat Nov 30 02:34:15 2002
It seems ring of elements does not save the energy stored in it over
quitting the mud.
Dunno what the intent was for the ring, iirc evoker's amulet saves
the energy channeled in it so maybe it is possible to have this
slight improvement for elemental too ?
Goro
-----------------
poster: Kelyr
subject: Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 02:00:44 2002
I just wanted to bring body of lava up for discussion, because I'm
'hoping' it could get a slight up-tune. As it is now, using Body of
lava gives me approximately +300 hps and 'some' phys resistance.
As it is now, I can't solo a sidhe in one run, it's taking me 2
sometimes 3 or 4 runs to take down a sidhe. Now I'd also like to
mention that I'm using strengthen armor to give all my eq +phy res.
I hate when people compare guilds and I'm not saying I want lava
mage to become super powerful. But as it stands, there is a reason
not many play lava mage for soloing. It's because they can't take
any damage! And the difference in damage between output between mist
mage and lava mage is comparable. 4 round extremely high damage vs 3
round very high green mist . . . I'm only making about 1M an hour
rate, while a mist mage with my worth could be juggling 2M or
higher.
I'd just like to see body of lava given a slight increase for
protection . . . Or if maybe you could make the jets of lava it
projects stronger. Stripping the damage resistances with damage
output would be really neat! Considering how those little jets of
lava do non-noticeable damage. I'd just like to see lava mage be
played more, and maybe give players an option between "well do I
want to solo with fire and good damage, or do I want to solo with
poison and ultimate defenses?"
It's my consideration that lava mage currently needs a bit of a
power up. And I hope others will agree with me ^_^
-Kelyr
-----------------
poster: Litho
subject: >Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 04:29:43 2002
On Sat Dec 7 02:00:44 2002 Kelyr wrote post #48:
> protection . . . Or if maybe you could make the jets of lava it
> projects stronger. Stripping the damage resistances with damage
> output would be really neat! Considering how those little jets of
> lava do non-noticeable damage. I'd just like to see lava mage be
> played more, and maybe give players an option between "well do I
> want to solo with fire and good damage, or do I want to solo with
> poison and ultimate defenses?"
> It's my consideration that lava mage currently needs a bit of a
> power up. And I hope others will agree with me ^_^
> -Kelyr
Thats a good point.
What good also help is a lower spell cost for boulder and/or lessen
cast time, up body/wall like you said.
-Litho
-----------------
poster: Tranquil
subject: >Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 05:22:47 2002
>I just wanted to bring body of lava up for discussion, because I'm
>'hoping' it could get a slight up-tune. As it is now, using Body of
>lava gives me approximately +300 hps and 'some' phys resistance.
>As it is now, I can't solo a sidhe in one run, it's taking me 2
>sometimes 3 or 4 runs to take down a sidhe.
I am woodsman, with one body, and a little higher worth than you do,
Kelyr. I have an almost completely topslot dex set, and those items
I have that are not topslot, are not far from it.
While I am not blowing my trumpet as it were, I am well known as
being one of the best soloing woodsmen in the mud, simply because I
a) have set my char up that way, and b) choose to solo as much as I
do.
With my current worth, I cannot solo a sidhe in one run. In fact, it
would take 4 or 5 to solo a sidhe for myself. Sure, yours was a
mage/mage comparison, but consider two things.
1) Lava is not an entirely solo guild, it is more of a
blaster+healer duo guild, where mist is a solo guild, as defined by
the properties and restrictions of mist form.
2) Considering the woodsman's ability to dodge, and the healing
enchantments that we have, I would say that you aren't doing too bad
as a lava to solo them in 2-4 runs.
>But as it stands, there is a reason
>not many play lava mage for soloing. It's because they can't take
>any damage!
The reason why most people don't go lava for solo, is the same
reason most people don't go healer to blast. It just doesn't make
sense to join a guild for a job which it is not specifically suited
for, or to try and play a guild in a way it is not designed to be
played.
>I'm only making about 1M an hour
>rate, while a mist mage with my worth could be juggling 2M or
>higher.
Try a different tactic. Grab a healer, then go and kill a few sidhes
and see what it does to your rate. You might be pleasantly surprised
at the results.
>etc. etc. etc.
Moral of the story? Try multiple things to optimise your
effectiveness in a guild. Vary your playing style, grab a healer or
an abj, fight different monsters. Basically, try a number of
different things before saying 'There's not much point in this
guild', because without your own testing, you just might miss out on
the way to play that particular guild, that works optimally for
you.
-----------------
poster: Warchief
subject: >>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 06:27:19 2002
It was my belief that elementals were designed to be focused more on
soloing, with the exception of nether mage for eq. It's the main
(sole?) purpose of the body spells. Body of lava used to be a
somewhat considerable defense spell.
-Chief
-----------------
poster: Tranquil
subject: >>>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 06:58:36 2002
On Sat Dec 7 06:27:19 2002 Warchief wrote post #51:
> It was my belief that elementals were designed to be focused more on
> soloing, with the exception of nether mage for eq. It's the main
> (sole?) purpose of the body spells. Body of lava used to be a
> somewhat considerable defense spell.
>
> -Chief
BoL is no worse than it ever was. Simply, other guilds have been
coded that now fill the position's far more effectively than lava
once did.
And, I remember three+ years ago, lava's still did a whole lot
better with a healer than they did solo.
-----------------
poster: Warchief
subject: >>>>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 06:59:16 2002
On Sat Dec 7 06:58:36 2002 Tranquil wrote post #52:
> On Sat Dec 7 06:27:19 2002 Warchief wrote post #51:
> > It was my belief that elementals were designed to be focused more on
> > soloing, with the exception of nether mage for eq. It's the main
> > (sole?) purpose of the body spells. Body of lava used to be a
> > somewhat considerable defense spell.
> >
> > -Chief
>
> BoL is no worse than it ever was. Simply, other guilds have been
> coded that now fill the position's far more effectively than lava
> once did.
>
> And, I remember three+ years ago, lava's still did a whole lot
> better with a healer than they did solo.
>
Most everything does a lot better with a healer than they do solo.
-----------------
poster: Kelyr
subject: >>>>>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 08:26:42 2002
While I understand that lava mage may not quite be suited in your
definition as a solo guild, I would consider one of the primary
reasons someone would actually pick lava mage is to solo. From my
perspective, it looks like your trying to compare lava mage with
woodsman, that the two are both well complimented with a healer. And
I don't think thats the way you should view it . . . I think most
people see the lava mage guild as a soloing guild, or at least they
used to.
Also, I don't think it's a fair arguement for you to say "The reason
why most people don't go lava for solo, is the same
reason most people don't go healer to blast." is a completely unfair
unanalysis of the lava mage guild. Healer by it's very nature is not
a very good soloing guild, and second they don't have decent
blasting spell or protection spells until they can unlock the high
priest guild.
The point of this post also was not to compare my soloing tactics,
I'm just trying to make it away that Body of Lava is just not
powerful as I think it should be. I'm not saying I want a Wizard to
fine comb the tuning of the guild, but I think a little extra power
would be beneficial for everyone. Why would someone go lava mage
over mist mage? I assure you, I don't think anyone would go lava
mage with the intent of "duoing with a healer". It's my thinking
that no one would want to do that.
I think it's to the best interast of the Mud, if a Wizard could
possibly take a look into lava mage . . . I mean the guild is
already here, why not make it a little more appealing to play?
-Kelyr
-----------------
poster: Rancor
subject: >>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 10:09:53 2002
same thing right back at you tahnval your comparing a guild that
should not solo and is not built to solo at all. Woodsman is not a
solo guild. plain and simple never was never will be you need to at
leat get a ref spell in your second alpha before it is even
possible. Your all duo and party based for the most part. yes you
solo only because you have streatched your worth and gone for the
heal spell forcing your character to do somethin outside of what it
is designed for. I am not talkin out my ass here outside of you
tigger, tuffgong I am one of the player that has spent the mowst
time and worth as woodsman they are far far far cry from a solo
guild. your comparision does not hold water.
kelyr is on the right track yes lava mage is weaker than mist mage
however about half the rate is a little excessive. I myself have
partied with kelyr he can do the damage but he can not take it at
all.
and with a prot up and evben more than one prot it should effect it
a bit more than that. especially for a solo based guild(note based
means not all solo but mostly)
Rancor
-----------------
poster: Tranquil
subject: >>>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 16:37:08 2002
>same thing right back at you tahnval
Let's get one thing straight. My name is not Tahnval.
>your comparing a guild that
>should not solo and is not built to solo at all. Woodsman is not a
>solo guild. plain and simple never was never will be you need to at
>leat get a ref spell in your second alpha before it is even
>possible.
Actually, this is incorrect. I have been able to solo quite well
since 100m worth, being woodsman almost the entire way. And, if you
think woodsmen -need- a refresh spell to work? I'm sorry, but you're
wrong there too. Old woodsman prots (particularly gnome and
salamander guard) coupled with our poultices made soloing, while not
the most effective form of xp, still quite a feasible option for
people inclined or forced to do so.
Now, the same thing is possible with 2 leafblades with elec enchants
up. The special they give adds hp and ep. Coupled with a decent dex,
a nice race, and good skills, we dodge enough to take on certain
mobs (5-20k) for an effective solo rate (~3m if we work at it), and
with corpse eating added in, we're pretty much set. That is of
course, if we don't use fires, and chain our attack skill.
>Your all duo and party based for the most part.
Yes, we all are, aren't we? Thankyou for seeing my point with my
previous post. However, there are differing levels of effectiveness
at soloing.
Logic states that a guild with not just one healing ability, but
three distinctly different, and reliable ones, is more designed for
soloing than a guild without any reliable healing abilities at all.
Last time I checked, lava didn't have even one.
>yes you
>solo only because you have streatched your worth and gone for the
>heal spell forcing your character to do somethin outside of what it
>is designed for.
This is true. But no more true for me than is it for a lava mage.
Really, if I had taken more levels in the woodsman tree rather than
multi with cleric, I'd have been better off with my current playing
style than I am atm. However, I chose to do this because it gives me
the versatility to solo larger xp mobs if I choose.
With all due respect to you and Kelyr, I strongly feel that if
someone is considering lava, and also wishes to solo, they should
multi into cleric for at least, clw. I would say the same thing for
other guilds without an effective healing ability, such as evoker,
abjurer, or bard.
If they are not worth enough to multi, and they're looking for a
caster guild and wish to mainly solo, they should look at caster
guilds built specifically for the purpose of soloing, such as harmer
or druid.
> I am not talkin out my ass here outside of you
>tigger, tuffgong I am one of the player that has spent the mowst
>time and worth as woodsman they are far far far cry from a solo
>guild. your comparision does not hold water.
Sorry to say this mate, but if you sucked soloing as a woodsman,
that is a personal experience of yours - and not neccessarily one
shared by others who have happened to play in that particular
guildtree.
>kelyr is on the right track yes lava mage is weaker than mist mage
>however about half the rate is a little excessive. I myself have
>partied with kelyr he can do the damage but he can not take it at
>all. and with a prot up and evben more than one prot it should effect >it a
bit more than that. especially for a solo based guild(note based
>means not all solo but mostly)
Lava mage is not weaker than mist mage, just different. It is a more
well rounded guild. Lava's can duo with a healer, or be part of a
well balanced xp party without any detrimental effects on their
prot.
Mist is useful only for soloing with mist form, or occasionally,
partying with equipment on. Therefore, more suited to solo than lava
is.
If lava was made to solo as well as mist did, who would go mist?
no-one. Why? Lava do more damage, so why go mist if lava's can tank
as well as a mist, blast better, and have higher regen to boot?
I stand by my original post.
- Tranquil
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 22:24:36 2002
tell me, how do you feel about not being able to wear equipment
what would you do with those skill/spells you use to strengthen your equipment
also as mist if i had body up in a big party and took any dmg i
died. at least you get 'some' phys res and hp for area-survival out
of the deal
as mist due to not being able to use it alot of people dont have eq
which rules partying out
the reason not amny people go lava for solo is because it isnt
designed fo rthat
mist is
the two sides of the tree
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >>Body of Lava
date: Sat Dec 7 22:29:24 2002
having read the rest of the thread i would like to again compare
mage to cleric
mage->solo mist
mage->party lava
cleric->solo harmer
cleric->party healer
alot of the guilds have a similar thing going
korthprot Greater Shield [Down]
not cauldron vs psionics
er
note
etcetcetc blah blah
-----------------
poster: Kelyr
subject: >>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002
I had originally assumed that lava mage was a solo guild . . . If
you all really want to debate if lava mage is supposed to be a
'party' guild, then either way body of lava still needs an uptune.
As it stands, tanking sidhe even with a healer, I'd run into
constant snags, because
a. I don't have enough hps for a healer to play with.
b. I take damage so quickly.
When I say I'm taking damage quickly, I'm literally taking an
average of 200 hps a round. Now if body of lava I have 1400 hps.
That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
have difficulty!
Again I don't want to fight about what is a soloing guild and what
isn't. I just want some input from a wizard, or have them at least
glance over the guild and make sure it has all it's checks and
balances. Or maybe if a wizard could enlighten us about what they
had in mind for the lava mage guild? Is it a solo guild, a party
guild? It seems so petty to fight over this.
-Kelyr
-----------------
poster: Zyz
subject: >>>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 03:55:46 2002
There was a similar debate on this subject about 2 years ago. The
way I see it, lava mage is a decent party guild for people with
around 50-100m worth. Past that, other guilds are superior until
nether mage. The elemental tree is split, which makes it as
powerful as a single bravo guild for a long time. Once secondary
healing is attained, it is a bravo guild with a bit of healing.
Kinda sucks that the guild tree branches don't really help each
other, but that is how it is and has been forever. Anyway, remember
that lava body is a spell that people can get at below level 50,
iirc. It's pretty effective vs 20k things.. But for increasing
power up through level 80, lava mage is not really the way to go,
due to the tree split issue.
Lava wall is a nice spell.. with that the damage should decrease
significantly.. but I would recommend being a different guild tree
until enough worth for omicron. Lava is not very good for mid-high
worth people due to damage type, spell damage, spell efficiency,
etc..
-----------------
poster: Daneel
subject: >>>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002
On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> have difficulty!
That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
end up with all guilds too powerful.
-----------------
poster: Rancor
subject: lavamage
date: Sun Dec 8 10:15:30 2002
I believce that each guild in its own right should be able to
increase in rate as you gain higher and higher worth no matter what
the guild is. a 2g lava mage should be able to get a signoificatly
better rate than a 600m lava mage. Now the way you all are
describing this is once you hit a certain worth the guild is fing
useless. Whoopee that makes a guild retarded. I mean other than
those who are 50 mil and those who have to be lavea in order to get
the nether mage guidl it is never used. is that right no. someone
should be able to use something that they are enrolled in at any
given worth, but who does noone does. What does a nether mage need
lava mage for. other than the body and the mastery iirc there is
not one spell that is used in that guild for a nether mage. What
makes that right? take woodsman for xample there is not a guild in
that tree where you are not useing some spell or some skills out of
every branch more that one or two. Perfect ex aple of the way a
guild should be set up nothing should be useless.
there has ben a recent rash or peoplem posting in parties such as
harmer with 105 slashing and 105 weapon skill blunt trained. ya
knwo what they are moking the guild cause they have nothing usefull
left to train. Notign worth the while so heyt lets train something
that does us absolutely no good at all.
Sound liek something I want to do.
Rancor
-----------------
poster: Bluemoon
subject: Lava Mage
date: Sun Dec 8 10:25:01 2002
I agree with rankwhore, all guilds should be able to be useful.
I had the same problem as a lava as described here, if with a decent
healer Id die often to anything above 20-30k....the dmg is just too
great, the only thing that lowered it was the wall, which is friggin
tappy.
I personally would love to use lava mage to solo, as I thought it
was fun, and the hours of endless fun creating lava eq helped as
well, even tho it basically did nothing but save my normaly eq from
wear and tear.
Mist is far superior to lava for solo, as we've discussed, as a lava
I cant even solo a goat, as a mist I can do two before
healing...makes ya wonder eh?
I thought both guilds were meant to solo, but lava just cant do it
unless body added more phys res or something, which was stated.
Just my two cents, but doing something to it would make it a lot
more appealing than it is...
Bluemoon
*reminds you to flame responsibly.
-----------------
poster: Kaos
subject: >>>>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 12:10:44 2002
On Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002 Daneel wrote post #61:
> On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> > That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> > have difficulty!
> That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
> mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
>
> People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
> balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
> end up with all guilds too powerful.
Have you noticed that these "whines" usually comes from people in
old guilds? (harmer, lava, thief) Why? Because all the new guilds
that are added are more powerful than the existing ones, thus leaving
those who play the old guilds less powerful.
-----------------
poster: Daneel
subject: >>>>>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 16:58:14 2002
On Sun Dec 8 12:10:44 2002 Kaos wrote post #64:
> On Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002 Daneel wrote post #61:
> > On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> > > That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> > > have difficulty!
> > That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
> > mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
> >
> > People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
> > balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
> > end up with all guilds too powerful.
> Have you noticed that these "whines" usually comes from people in
> old guilds? (harmer, lava, thief) Why? Because all the new guilds
> that are added are more powerful than the existing ones, thus leaving
> those who play the old guilds less powerful.
No.
I've heard it about: Harmer, healer, witch, shifter, warrior,
thief, MA, evoker, shifter, and woodsman. I don't remember
hearing it about druid, elemental, or abj, but I'm pretty
sure it's happened anyway
-----------------
poster: Lostego
subject: >>>>>>>Body of Lava
date: Sun Dec 8 19:44:43 2002
On Sun Dec 8 16:58:14 2002 Daneel wrote post #65:
> On Sun Dec 8 12:10:44 2002 Kaos wrote post #64:
> > On Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002 Daneel wrote post #61:
> > > On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> > > > That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> > > > have difficulty!
> > > That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
> > > mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
> > >
> > > People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
> > > balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
> > > end up with all guilds too powerful.
> > Have you noticed that these "whines" usually comes from people in
> > old guilds? (harmer, lava, thief) Why? Because all the new guilds
> > that are added are more powerful than the existing ones, thus leaving
> > those who play the old guilds less powerful.
> No.
> I've heard it about: Harmer, healer, witch, shifter, warrior,
> thief, MA, evoker, shifter, and woodsman. I don't remember
> hearing it about druid, elemental, or abj, but I'm pretty
> sure it's happened anyway
I would be very happy if you would add a stun resist spell to druid.
-----------------
poster: Jaws
subject: Prismatic Spray
date: Sun Dec 8 20:07:50 2002
This spell appears to be a leftover from old sorc tree
seeing as it does same dmg as bravo, same casting time, and doesnt pull
in amulet specials
Now I understand not making it stronger ok, but could we at least
lower the cast time by 1 round, and have it pull in amulet specials
maybe even add a un-tune ammy skill and then have it
pull in whatever special goes with the dtype the spell picks
I mean this spell in the omicron tree is about like
getting a cheap 20$ watch when u retire from 30 years on the job
My .02 cents
Jaws
-----------------
poster: Arkangyle
subject: >Prismatic Spray
date: Sun Dec 8 23:26:45 2002
On Sun Dec 8 20:07:50 2002 Jaws wrote post #67:
> This spell appears to be a leftover from old sorc tree
> seeing as it does same dmg as bravo, same casting time, and doesnt pull
> in amulet specials
>
> Now I understand not making it stronger ok, but could we at least
> lower the cast time by 1 round, and have it pull in amulet specials
> maybe even add a un-tune ammy skill and then have it
> pull in whatever special goes with the dtype the spell picks
>
> I mean this spell in the omicron tree is about like
> getting a cheap 20$ watch when u retire from 30 years on the job
>
>
>
> My .02 cents
>
> Jaws
I have brought up the lack of any real advantage to using this spell
before. I haven't thought of a good mechanism for truly making it
useful yet, but when I do I will suggest the change along. I think
it has a lot of potential, especially as the highest level spell in
evoker.
-----------------
poster: Artea
subject: >Prismatic Spray
date: Mon Dec 9 02:16:28 2002
It does slightly more damage then the bravo spells, in my
experience.. which makes it useful w/o abj.
-----------------
poster: Zyz
subject: >>Prismatic Spray
date: Mon Dec 9 02:40:09 2002
I've also done some testing with this. With an empty amulet and no
abj, it seems to do slightly more damage. However, the cost was
significantly higher than the bravo 4 rounders. So it has no
special effects, costs more, and does slightly higher base damage.
Make of that what you will. I often don't bother to train it.
-----------------
poster: Kaos
subject: >>>>>>>>Body of Lava
date: Mon Dec 9 08:11:42 2002
On Sun Dec 8 19:44:43 2002 Lostego wrote post #66:
> On Sun Dec 8 16:58:14 2002 Daneel wrote post #65:
> > On Sun Dec 8 12:10:44 2002 Kaos wrote post #64:
> > > On Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002 Daneel wrote post #61:
> > > > On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> > > > > That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> > > > > have difficulty!
> > > > That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
> > > > mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
> > > >
> > > > People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
> > > > balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
> > > > end up with all guilds too powerful.
> > > Have you noticed that these "whines" usually comes from people in
> > > old guilds? (harmer, lava, thief) Why? Because all the new guilds
> > > that are added are more powerful than the existing ones, thus leaving
> > > those who play the old guilds less powerful.
> > No.
> > I've heard it about: Harmer, healer, witch, shifter, warrior,
> > thief, MA, evoker, shifter, and woodsman. I don't remember
> > hearing it about druid, elemental, or abj, but I'm pretty
> > sure it's happened anyway
> I would be very happy if you would add a stun resist spell to druid.
Another one?
-----------------
poster: Goroharahad
subject: >>>>>>>Body of Lava
date: Mon Dec 9 13:26:43 2002
On Sun Dec 8 16:58:14 2002 Daneel wrote post #65:
> On Sun Dec 8 12:10:44 2002 Kaos wrote post #64:
> > On Sun Dec 8 04:41:09 2002 Daneel wrote post #61:
> > > On Sun Dec 8 00:48:56 2002 Kelyr wrote post #59:
> > > > That means unless a healer is on his or her toes, they are going to
> > > > have difficulty!
> > > That sounds pretty much perfect. If that's not true for other
> > > mage guilds, I'd say those other mage guilds are out of tune.
> > >
> > > People keep requesting, "please tune up my guild, as it's out of
> > > balance." If we go with even a fraction of such requests, we'd
> > > end up with all guilds too powerful.
> > Have you noticed that these "whines" usually comes from people in
> > old guilds? (harmer, lava, thief) Why? Because all the new guilds
> > that are added are more powerful than the existing ones, thus leaving
> > those who play the old guilds less powerful.
> No.
> I've heard it about: Harmer, healer, witch, shifter, warrior,
> thief, MA, evoker, shifter, and woodsman. I don't remember
> hearing it about druid, elemental, or abj, but I'm pretty
> sure it's happened anyway
Hmm I can fix this partially Daneel :)
Not that I think elemental sucks but ppls keep telling this to me.
Like :
Lu [ManySorcsAndOneNether]: Goro, why don't u attune acid ?
SO I think Lu would appreciate my reporting her whine ;)
Goro
-----------------
poster: Daneel
subject: Whining for guild improvement
date: Mon Dec 9 17:13:51 2002
I'd like to thank everyone who worked so hard to complete my
list of guilds for which improvements have been whinily requested.
I do notice y'all forgot bard, but I also remember I've whined
for a stun prot in it myself, so I think we're set for the
moment.
Now, no one is allowed to add new guilds unless they have some
clear whines prepared.
-----------------
poster: Shadowmage
subject: lava mage
date: Mon Dec 9 17:43:44 2002
I think that in terms of pros and cons, lava mages should be about the
same as mist mages. Lava mages should have more powerful blasts, while
mist mages have more powerful defenses. In order to make them more equal,
however, i think that Magma Boulder's casting time should be either 1. reduced
to 3, or 2. be slightly more powerful. Body of lava is a nice improvement over
stone or fire, but no where close to that of mist. Therefore, the power of the
lava blast spell needs to be tuned to suit that con.
Flames appreciated, Shadow
-----------------
poster: Arkangyle
subject: >lava mage
date: Mon Dec 9 18:53:07 2002
On Mon Dec 9 17:43:44 2002 Shadowmage wrote post #74:
> I think that in terms of pros and cons, lava mages should be about the
> same as mist mages. Lava mages should have more powerful blasts, while
> mist mages have more powerful defenses. In order to make them more equal,
> however, i think that Magma Boulder's casting time should be either 1.
reduced
> to 3, or 2. be slightly more powerful. Body of lava is a nice improvement
over
> stone or fire, but no where close to that of mist. Therefore, the power of
the
> lava blast spell needs to be tuned to suit that con.
> Flames appreciated, Shadow
I do hereby flame as per the following:
Lava mages can wear equipment, this inflicts the following boons
above mist mages:
1. MUCH higher spr rate. The spr of a 2g maxed nether using mist
is equivalent to that of a midbie lava mage using equipment.
2. Stats, stats, stats!!! Mist mages often have MUCH lower
int/wisdom than lava mages, making their spells less efficient and
less powerful in that regard.
3. Mist mages take a large hit on hps when in mist form. Lava
mages keep their base + anything that the equipment they wear offers
them. Why is this such a factor when you look at mist mage
resistances? ... SPELLS ... mists often must pick and choose very
carefully the areas they dwell within to avoid frequent deaths,
while lava mages enjoy them comfortably.
All this said and done, why do I consider lava to be effective when
I myself chose mist? ... The answer for that is because I, along
with Malifix, were the ONLY mist mages for a great deal of time, as
lava was considered more effective. Has either guild changed at all
since? No.
I know that lavas can effectively tank sidhes because I've seen it
... though that doesn't matter. If you can't handle sidhes, maybe
you should kill something smaller. Test out unused areas like I had
to do when I was a mist mage. Find what works for you. My only
beef with elemental is that lava/mist/nether all conflict. You
either use one or another ... but they do not add together
power-wise making advancement tedious.
- Ark
-----------------
poster: Afkaserious
subject: >Whining for guild improvement
date: Mon Dec 9 23:47:54 2002
On Mon Dec 9 17:13:51 2002 Daneel wrote post #73:
> I'd like to thank everyone who worked so hard to complete my
> list of guilds for which improvements have been whinily requested.
> I do notice y'all forgot bard, but I also remember I've whined
> for a stun prot in it myself, so I think we're set for the
> moment.
>
> Now, no one is allowed to add new guilds unless they have some
> clear whines prepared.
I want to be able to instakill absolutely everything in every guild
I ever play, and a exp button, and a goto button too plz.
-----------------
poster: Ligea
subject: Stop picking on lava mage!!
date: Mon Dec 16 18:31:39 2002
With all these highbies picking on lava I just wanted to point out
how awesome it is at lower worth. You get the main blast spell at
lvl 42 and while you do have to train the masteries it is both more
powerful and more efficient than incinerate, so a decent fire mage
becomes a good lava mage. While it may not be a "solo" guild it is
possible to solo well if you choose your opponents carefully...if
you buy engregs you can get 1 m/ hour at 70 m worth. I'm not sure
which other guilds can pull that off...
Lava also parties well, again on the strength of a nice offensive
spell. I've been in larger parties where I was getting 14% of the
party share and over half the kills, and stone body is great for a
few extra hps in eq. Another spell I like is stoneskin. I think it
is often overlooked once people start using the bodies, but it
really helps. It comes up fast in emergencies (ie tank dies) and if
you're lucky and have a good healer you may survive a 250k blocker
(Ca rocks!).
In summary: at lower levels it blasts well, tanks well, and parties
well. I can see where it would max early but even if it does it's
great from about 45m to 100m which is enough to "advance" to mist or
do whatever you want to do...
Flame away, I'm perfectly happy how it is... -L
-----------------
poster: Malifix
subject: >Stop picking on lava mage!!
date: Tue Dec 17 08:12:54 2002
Lava mage rocks for gold and exp. Panacea loves it. :)
-----------------
poster: Fox
subject: Nether Form
date: Wed Jan 8 08:51:52 2003
Warning message from Nether Form about to fall.
It wasn't even near 15 seconds later nether form fell.
There needs to be more time between the warning and the fall of nether form.
-----------------
poster: Goroharahad
subject: >Nether Form
date: Wed Jan 8 13:31:15 2003
On Wed Jan 8 08:51:52 2003 Fox wrote post #79:
> Warning message from Nether Form about to fall.
> It wasn't even near 15 seconds later nether form fell.
> There needs to be more time between the warning and the fall of nether form.
Actually the warning does not even always kick in.
Don't rely on it too much, you should use a timer and use the
warning as additional safety
-----------------
poster: Mixer
subject: >>Whining for guild improvement
date: Thu Jan 9 01:17:10 2003
On Mon Dec 9 23:47:54 2002 Afkaserious wrote post #76:
> On Mon Dec 9 17:13:51 2002 Daneel wrote post #73:
> > I'd like to thank everyone who worked so hard to complete my
> > list of guilds for which improvements have been whinily requested.
> > I do notice y'all forgot bard, but I also remember I've whined
> > for a stun prot in it myself, so I think we're set for the
> > moment.
> >
> > Now, no one is allowed to add new guilds unless they have some
> > clear whines prepared.
> I want to be able to instakill absolutely everything in every guild
> I ever play, and a exp button, and a goto button too plz.
Become a wizard :)
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >>>Whining for guild improvement
date: Thu Jan 9 01:22:52 2003
i clear this group out alot so missed the original post but if your
asking for whiny guild tweaks heres my two cents
abjurer
tune shield to remove
party lesser shields would remove all lessers
party greater shields would remove all greaters
its just a time saver
with the amount of time remove shields takes to cast it doesnt cost much sps
it would prolly cost more sps to cast another pls or pgs
im fine with the more sps thing mainly
im lazy and i ahte waiting
thanks
-----------------
poster: Gamut
subject: flame blade
date: Mon Jan 13 01:32:37 2003
i recently made a flame blade and got bored so i used identify on
it. What i found was that the blade gave a 4 point bonus to weapon
skill piercing. Now honestly, how many elementals actually have
weapon skill piercing? could the bonus possibly go into a more
useful skill...say high energy focus or qc?
-----------------
poster: Tranquil
subject: >flame blade
date: Mon Jan 13 02:38:57 2003
On Mon Jan 13 01:32:37 2003 Gamut wrote post #84:
> i recently made a flame blade and got bored so i used identify on
> it. What i found was that the blade gave a 4 point bonus to weapon
> skill piercing. Now honestly, how many elementals actually have
> weapon skill piercing? could the bonus possibly go into a more
> useful skill...say high energy focus or qc?
Mages actually used to get weapon skill piercing, a long time ago.
But, with the removal of said skill, it is probably a good idea to
change it to something more useful for elementalists.
Each of the elementalist gamma guilds has it's own weapon. In place
of the weapon skill for each of these items (assuming each gives a
weapon skill), I would suggest giving that same % bonus to the
elemental mastery for that guild, so a Flame blade would give a
bonus to Mastery of fire, etc.
That way the bonus fits with the guild in question, while not giving
a automatic, potentially overly large and imbalancing bonus to a
generic skill such as Quick chant or HEF.
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: Body of Lava
date: Mon Jan 20 00:54:02 2003
Why doesn't this guild have a spell torevert you to mortal form?
Oversight?
I need to read help files better?
or......
-----------------
poster: Wildchild
subject: >Body of Lava
date: Mon Jan 20 00:56:17 2003
On Mon Jan 20 00:54:02 2003 Korthrun wrote post #86:
> Why doesn't this guild have a spell torevert you to mortal form?
> Oversight?
> I need to read help files better?
> or......
To follow this up, Korthrun mentioned that he wanted to go from body
of lava to mist form. This is about the only reason you'd need to
revert from lava (or another lesser body), but useful nonetheless.
What I'm curious about is why do we have, or even need, more than
one spell to revert? We have revert form in the lesser guilds, then
solidify in mist mage.
All of the body spells are major prots, so why not just use the one
spell, revert form, for ALL of the body spells?
-WildChild
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: >>Body of Lava
date: Mon Jan 20 00:58:18 2003
The idea of different ones makes some sense.
In the basic elemental guilds you use revert form.
In things like mist/lava/nether you are dealing with more than one
element at a time
You need a stronger spell and different studies for learning how to
properly combine/uncombine these elements.
-----------------
poster: Korthrun
subject: summon elemental items
date: Thu Jan 30 21:18:40 2003
I'm not sure why really, it just seems that these should be dested
when you die.
Stuff like ice pick and air shield. I don't mind it as is, since it
saves me time and sps.
-----------------
poster: Goroharahad
subject: Wall of elemental energy
date: Sun Feb 9 07:48:06 2003
I have been pondering the use of wall of elemental energy for some
time, and I don't manage to find a use.
Basically here is what I stated
- the spcost and fact that it disappears when u move make it useless
in exp as tank.
- the protection is not really great so it doesn't help staying
noticeably longer against big mobs (when trying to explore for
instance). U gain aybe one or 2 rounds on first run,then sinceit
disappears u just have to forget about it.
Plus the fact it proves quite deadly wen u exceed nether energy
(insta death for one too much summon matter ...)
Maybe I am missing a point here. Any nether or ex-nether managed to
use this spell efficiently ?
Goro the clueless
-----------------
poster: Trunks
subject: >Wall of elemental energy
date: Sun Feb 9 08:02:19 2003
nethers in the arena use it pretty well..
-----------------
poster: Quillz
subject: >Wall of elemental energy
date: Sun Feb 9 23:01:26 2003
On Sun Feb 9 07:48:06 2003 Goroharahad wrote post #90:
> I have been pondering the use of wall of elemental energy for some
> time, and I don't manage to find a use.
> Basically here is what I stated
> - the spcost and fact that it disappears when u move make it useless
> in exp as tank.
> - the protection is not really great so it doesn't help staying
> noticeably longer against big mobs (when trying to explore for
> instance). U gain aybe one or 2 rounds on first run,then sinceit
> disappears u just have to forget about it.
>
> Plus the fact it proves quite deadly wen u exceed nether energy
> (insta death for one too much summon matter ...)
>
> Maybe I am missing a point here. Any nether or ex-nether managed to
> use this spell efficiently ?
>
> Goro the clueless
I never bothered with nether wall, I always used wall of lava.
As nether, you already (should) have the masteries necessary for WoL.
Granted, the SP cost is high, and it falls when you move, but it
provides some crazy protection, as well as dishes out a little bit
of damage.
-----------------
poster: Litho
subject: >>Wall of elemental energy
date: Mon Feb 10 07:27:40 2003
On Sun Feb 9 23:01:26 2003 Quillz wrote post #92:
> On Sun Feb 9 07:48:06 2003 Goroharahad wrote post #90:
> > I have been pondering the use of wall of elemental energy for some
> > time, and I don't manage to find a use.
> > Basically here is what I stated
> > - the spcost and fact that it disappears when u move make it useless
> > in exp as tank.
> > - the protection is not really great so it doesn't help staying
> > noticeably longer against big mobs (when trying to explore for
> > instance). U gain aybe one or 2 rounds on first run,then sinceit
> > disappears u just have to forget about it.
> >
> > Plus the fact it proves quite deadly wen u exceed nether energy
> > (insta death for one too much summon matter ...)
> >
> > Maybe I am missing a point here. Any nether or ex-nether managed to
> > use this spell efficiently ?
> >
> > Goro the clueless
> I never bothered with nether wall, I always used wall of lava.
> As nether, you already (should) have the masteries necessary for WoL.
> Granted, the SP cost is high, and it falls when you move, but it
> provides some crazy protection, as well as dishes out a little bit
> of damage.
>
Ahem, WOL _USED_ to give insane protection, it was roughly 350-450
sps a cast, and used to give enough prot to kill a ~130k mob without
having to run. But since Dfalt was lava+healer they tuned it, like
abjurer as 2ndary guild. Afaik, unless you have insane regen and
cleric levels, there is really no point in using any walls, unless
trying smallish eq with a healer/abj